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  #21  
Old 09-28-2007, 09:50 AM
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Default Re: Apple: Next iPhone update could break unlocked phones.

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Originally Posted by Galvatron View Post
if you understand why support a company that breaks the law on unlocking phones and violates att policy on buying handsets outright at invoice an are more than entitled to the unlock code? i understand the business world cause i live in it.
There has been a clear and concise argument put forth from lawyers on this issue and apple being apple you think they didn't consult their considerably high priced and large legal team about this matter? What world does one live in to think that Apple wouldn't cover their bases?

I just don't understand where this hostility comes from towards apple.

They didn't violate the act you mention and if they did, nor did they violate the Magnuson-Moss act. I really don't understand why people seem to think that Apple is a big bad monster here for protecting their interests. Considering that EVERY one of us a metaphorical comparison would also move to protect our interests should we come up with some business plan that needed protection. I really just don't understand that mindset of those who are upset at apple, I think they are acting on impulse and not thinking through the reality of the situation, that or they just don't understand reality.
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  #22  
Old 09-28-2007, 11:43 AM
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Default Re: Apple: Next iPhone update could break unlocked phones.

Thank you for your response, Galvatron.

Before we continue, can you give me your thoughts on Microsoft, Sony, Viacom, Linux and the EFF? Once again, I'm just looking for ways to relate.

Last edited by j__1; 09-28-2007 at 11:58 AM.
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  #23  
Old 09-28-2007, 12:22 PM
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Default Re: Apple: Next iPhone update could break unlocked phones.

The warranty question aside, if it can successfully be proved that Apple intentionally designed the update software to damage unlocked iPhones, they will likely be found to have committed a constitutionally-prohibited "taking" of property without just compensation, exposing them to considerable liability.

Last edited by f00l; 09-28-2007 at 12:51 PM.
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Old 09-28-2007, 01:06 PM
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Default Re: Apple: Next iPhone update could break unlocked phones.

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The warranty question aside, if it can successfully be proved that Apple intentionally designed the update software to damage unlocked iPhones, they will likely be found to have committed an constitutionally-prohibited "taking" of property without just compensation, exposing them to considerable liability.
Possibly... but who wants to go there? The more I look at this, the more I cheer on Apple. Not because I'm into locking users into a platform... but because they have no qualms with going head-to-head with their partners. Their objective is pretty clear (i.e., sell hardware), and I applaud any decision to challenge those that are so disconnected from their customer base.

This argument appears to go well beyond Apple. Even if Apple was to lose... who is to say they won't benefit?

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Last edited by j__1; 09-28-2007 at 01:08 PM.
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  #25  
Old 09-28-2007, 01:51 PM
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Default Re: Apple: Next iPhone update could break unlocked phones.

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Originally Posted by j__1 View Post
Possibly... but who wants to go there? The more I look at this, the more I cheer on Apple. Not because I'm into locking users into a platform... but because they have no qualms with going head-to-head with their partners. Their objective is pretty clear (i.e., sell hardware), and I applaud any decision to challenge those that are so disconnected from their customer base.

This argument appears to go well beyond Apple. Even if Apple was to lose... who is to say they won't benefit?

Anyone for a mixtape? I made one just for you.
I think what Apple just did is actually the opposite of what you just said. With the latest update, they aren't going against their partners, but actually with them. Think about it, all those people who unlocked iPhones and took them abroad, and did the latest update, will now be forced to purchase the iPhone and get the carrier Apple has the agreement with in their respective countries. Yes they make money on hardware alone, but when they are making money off of a yearly contract, that ends up being more profitable. For Apple anyway.

I am, and have always been, an Apple fanboy. I, however, do not like what they did if their update was made to intentionally make unlocked iPhones unusable (at the moment anyways). If it was unintentional, which i think it was, then whatever, because the hacking community always is ready for the next project, especially with something as big as the iPhone. The sad part is, the ones with unlocked iPhones are the hardcore Apple fan-base, since they love Apple, but despise signing up with ATT, and are willing to modify their pieces of hardware (whether they are voiding their warranty out, knowingly or not). Either way, Apple has made their move, it's the hacking communities move next, and we'll see where that road takes. If you want an unlocked iPhone (and a plethora of 3rd party apps), pick up an iPhone now, while the 1.0.2's are still available. And don't update until Jailbreak and AnySIM are updated for 1.1.1.
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Old 09-28-2007, 02:14 PM
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Default Re: Apple: Next iPhone update could break unlocked phones.

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Originally Posted by j__1 View Post
Possibly... but who wants to go there? The more I look at this, the more I cheer on Apple. Not because I'm into locking users into a platform... but because they have no qualms with going head-to-head with their partners. Their objective is pretty clear (i.e., sell hardware), and I applaud any decision to challenge those that are so disconnected from their customer base.
1.) Who wants to go there? I feel fairly secure in saying that ANYONE with a BRICKED phone would most definitely want to "go there," and apparently that's quite a few people. In addition, anyone who wants to defend consumer rights protected by federal legislation and the U.S. Constitution would certainly want to "go there."

I think that a better question is who DOESN'T want to "go there?" The answer: Corporate apologists and Apple Corp. shills who plague message boards and defend their corporate masters... simple.

2.) Define "going head-to-head with their partners." This statement is meaningless without elaboration and context. Who is the "they" whose "partners" you reference? Who are the partners? What actions constitute "going head-to-head? And what is the objective of such?

3.) Who is "so disconnected with their customer base" that you "applaud any decision to challenge" them? It sounds like you are talking about Apple Corp itself here, but you were just DEFENDING them in the previous sentences. Please explain this seeming contradiction.

"Cheering Apple on" in this situation effectively means that you also condone such action by any and all other companies, basically condoning conduct that likely amounts to violations of the RICO Act and anti-trust statutes. I imagine you'd have a very different
attitude if you were the proud new owner of a $600 paperweight.

Please elaborate and explain your position.
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  #27  
Old 09-28-2007, 02:29 PM
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Default Re: Apple: Next iPhone update could break unlocked phones.

It is possible that given the legal status of unlocking a phone under the DMCA, doing so should not void Apple's warranty and they can be held liable for refusing to honor said warranty.

A more interesting issue in my mind is whether the 1.1.1 update was intentionally engineered to damage and/or render inoperable any iPhone that had been unlocked. If so, and it can be proven, then such conduct would amount to destruction of property.

Is it possible to determine the contents of the software update to analyze whether it was designed to damage unlocked phones?
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  #28  
Old 09-28-2007, 02:36 PM
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Default Re: Apple: Next iPhone update could break unlocked phones.

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Originally Posted by kinjutsu11 View Post
I think what Apple just did is actually the opposite of what you just said. With the latest update, they aren't going against their partners, but actually with them. .
While I agree with the basis of your argument, as opposed to M$ and Sony, Apple continues, from my perspective, to walk a tightrope.

Granted, Apple must take steps to live up to their end of the contract. However, they continue to not support 'features' such as HDCP in their monitors or video cards, even though their 'partners' would like to close that loop. When it comes to FairPlay, we are still able to use 12 month old cracks to strip DRM from iTunes products.

All I'm saying is, they don't appear to be devoting much in the way of resources to 'protect' their partner's outdated business models... or at least not as much as Microsoft and Sony.

Last edited by j__1; 09-28-2007 at 02:56 PM.
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  #29  
Old 09-28-2007, 03:20 PM
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Default Re: Apple: Next iPhone update could break unlocked phones.

Even M$ isn't crazy enough to pull a stunt like this
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Old 09-28-2007, 03:40 PM
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Default Re: Apple: Next iPhone update could break unlocked phones.

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Even M$ isn't crazy enough to pull a stunt like this
Noooo Microsoft has never been sued for poor business practices or strong-arming computer companies...nothing has been in the news lately about Microsoft and the European Union. Nope, there goes Microsoft, clean as a whistle.
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